A letter to our dearest friend Thomas, who expects to be IDC leader soon....
Herr Thomas Becht
DV Vice President
DV Richter
P.O.R. Cheerleader
Adresse: Schulzenstr. 2 PLZ,
Ort: 76771 Hördt
Telefon: +49 (0) 7272 5779
Fax: +49 (0) 7272 760036
E-Mail: thomas.becht@dobermann.de
My dear Thomas,
Wishing you a most interesting 2013, our Teutonic friend
How is the weather in Moscow, your second home? We hope you are keeping warm in some new shoes, and your lessons in Russian are coming along well.
Bechti, Please help us to understand some very disturbing news we got, regarding a ZTP which was done in Germany on 1 May 2010. Yes, we understand that it was couple years ago,and you cannot remember anything much beyond yesterday, but do please try.
You were the Chairman of this ZTP and the judge was your dear Knuddelmuddel, Uncle Wibli. The results are also here - 2010-05-01_ZTP_Germany
A few dogs from your own kennel breeding were also present, but of course it did not matter that the breeder was also the ZTP Test Chairman. After all, which ordinary German would question this? You have a great style of judging your own breeding, which we must admire as being so unique.
Bechti my boy, we see one dog - Norbert Vom Klingbach as having obtain the result of ZTP V1A. Praise the memory of the Fuhrer! Congratulations on this awarded result for your breeding!
But, my dear Bechti, how was it this dog also has a HIP SCORE OF HD-3? I mean, i read in the DV Dobermann magazine, that Norbert vom Klingbach is listed as having such a poor hip result? The magazine is dated 03/2011, before the ZTP exam you were chairman of.
But as Chairman, were you not aware of this? All was approved surely, by Mrs Meyer-Becht too? What can be the explanation, dear Thomas Mausi, for siuch a disturbing revelation?
Ok, perhaps we should enlarge it here below so you can see more clearly, as we notice you now also like to wear spectacles and smoke cigar like dear Leader.
Is it clearer now? There were people there who saw this dog at the ZTP, and he was examined and judged by your lovely father. Bit, when we look at the results on the DV website - ZTP Results
dear Nobie was omitted and not recorded at all.. Are you embarrassed dear Bechti? You dont need to be,after all, you are a very proud and loud man.
Bechti baby, we see that you are now being crowned already as the New Emperor! Is the King already dead? Long live the New King?
How wonderful my dearest German Mausi.. I am sure you have so much planned ahead for everyone to make us all bow before you...
Do reply soon, we are sure so many people are eager for news and advise from your great self..
Your Friends
D.I.
January 1, 2013
well if a dog receives a HD-3 Result of course it is possible to retake the x-ray and send it in a second time for evaluation. i am sure this happened with norbert v. klingbach and for sure he turned out to be HD-2. only really bad people would think now, that he got a HD-2 score just because he is out of the breeding of our new FÜHRER. ;) only really bad people would think something like this..... *LOL* there is always a good explanation for everything. specially out of the mouth of our Bechty...
ReplyDeletethey are fucked. breeders or owner, how long will they tolerate this yet? happy new year
ReplyDeleteBut about HD score of Hertog Alpha and Don Dayan , males considered etalons at high level ? Aaaa? What about that ?
ReplyDeleteBut about many other promoted studmales which infected entire race with teheir cancer, DCM and character ?
HD scores 3 or in Holland plus min were officialy regonised at that time it was not official to breed a HD 3 dog to an another HD 3 dog, but a HD 3 dog with a HD 1 dog was no problem later the rules were changed.
ReplyDeleteInsider! Happy New Year and of course Give that Man a Bells!!!Insider of course :) - we look forward to the 2013 posts
ReplyDeleteHD 3 mean a shit with rules or without rules.
ReplyDeleteAnd now we ask why race is fully by displazia and wobbler ?
the breed is full, with illness and losing of Working ability and genetic diversity. but this is no new info. The problem is that the people follow the DV like slaves. my attempt to bring about a change in my forum was not used.
ReplyDeletedobermann-verein-ev do you heard about Facebook ?
ReplyDeleteIf you have something to say, why you don't construct your page?
all I have to say, you can read at dobermann-verein-ev.de and click on forum or dobermannforum.com
ReplyDelete@dobe.ev.de , you maked a error in your forum , you wroted on German language or ... only few peoples talk this language .
ReplyDeleteAll international forums are in English language.
More that , in last 1-2 years , all forums are died , but you can find almost all breeders on Facebook .
google translator :-) I need also. my english is bad. It does not matter anything. These are all slaves who live in fear of loosing of favor of Wibli. No dialogue about the problems is possible. not on german, not in english. the large part of the doberman friends can only anonymously whine.
ReplyDeleteThere are more than fear ...In reality things are more complicated .
ReplyDeleteThere are interest, moneys, vanity ,and love.
Why I said that ? because this world becomed a viciouse circle , inocent peoples get dobermanns from that lines and they love their dobermanns .
Many people don't know and don't understood what happened here because they have not knowledges about dobermanns history, bloodlines ....
But you can be sure, many peoples which keep silance understood the problems ...And problems are genetical .
Back that 5 generations majority actual dobermanns descend from trend bloodlines which majority lived less than 10 years , many of them only 4-8 years .
That ill and no-brain domination almost destroyed this race .
The problem is that there is NO concrete information about the old bloodlines and the whole background which belongs to them.
ReplyDeleteI think many people (especially beginners) would decide otherwise if they would have the right information. But they can't find it ANYWHERE.
Today all is muxed , almoat nithing remained from historical lines . Unfortunately histoeical lines are losted and substituted by same trend showlines which died less than 8-10 years .
ReplyDeleteLet's be honest and down-to-earth...
ReplyDeleteA dobermann isn't considered as a working breed nowadays. It's just a impressive dog, which makes our eyes happy.
A very few of us buy a dobermann to work with him. It is just a couch-dog, a blawhard-dog. Or how many of the dobermann-owners go to a dog training field??? I think less than 10%.
The most people who work with the dog, want just get the ZTP and IPO to able to breed or access the working class on the shows to have bigger chances to win.
And that's the main issue.
The interested parties for the breed changed. And that is not only a mistake of Wibli, Becht, ... or the breeders. The puppy buyers are also at fault.
I don't want to protect the ruthless behaviour of the breeders and the national clubs (especially DV) but you have to agree that is a fact that the national clubs and the breeders give a puppy buyer just what he wants.
Nowadays nobody is interested in a dobermann as working dog. So the working abilities are lost.
The only thing we can do is to try to breed healthy dogs to rescue the breed.
You have right in what you said about today dobermanns . But that do not mean to lost original character , smartness and breed idiot dobes with great dane eyes and no brain in their big heads with strong stops and much skin .
ReplyDeleteAnd that do not mean to breed that lines which are died at 7-8 years . That do not mean to breed a dobermann fully by illnesses !
Before the interested parties respectively puppy buyers didn't change their opinion/wishes/imagination about a "real dobermann", NOTHING will happen!!!
ReplyDeleteThe clubs and the breeders only satisfy the demand/market. It is just a dirty business!
The market decides which dogs will be bred, not the clubs and not the breeders.
You can elect everyone you want as IDC-President, DV-President, etc. It doesn't matter. They will still try to give satisfaction to the market. Because it is the only way to earn money!
There is no difference to the "normal" economy. As a salesman you must give the customer what he wants.
So, the market has to rethink to rescue our glory breed!
Unfortunately the market is much more interested in a ridiculous trophy, a laughable title instead of a physically and mentally healthy breed.
ReplyDeleteAnd this is the reason for the whole dilemma!
Unfortunately the market is much more interested in a ridiculous trophy, a laughable title instead of a physically and mentally healthy breed.
ReplyDeleteAnd this is the reason for the whole dilemma!
Many true words. But, even if a portion of the buyer wanted a sofa Doberman, this was no reason for the desolate breeding policy. You have to understand. nepotism and greed from Wibli and friends, have excellent bloodlines let die and thus became extinct. This concluded an extremely shrunken gene pool and the resulting diseases. Similarly, this was the end of the breed as a sport and use dog. The sportmen moved to malli and Schäferhund.
ReplyDeletedobermann-verein-ev.de said..." This concluded an extremely shrunken gene pool and the resulting disease "
ReplyDeleteNot exactly...the reduced genepool can generate consanguinity depression but inbreed in clear genes remain clear genes, a healtly race remain healtly.
The problem is that longevive original and right hiostorical blood-lines are substituted with actual ill genepool in a no-brain and idiot genetical reduction .
These health problems are not new and caused by recent breeding. They have been in the breed for a long time, maybe from the beginning. Read the story of Illena and the Seven Sires. All were bred from Germany's best of the late 1930's. Half died of "Heart Attacks".
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
ReplyDelete"These health problems are not new and caused by recent breeding. They have been in the breed for a long time, maybe from the beginning. ....".
This is a LIE !
Yes, YOUR bloodlines was ill and no-brain from begining, but in world many bloodlines was 15 years longevity.
Where are they today ?
Was dissapeared in your shit selection and shows ...
In reality dobermann breed was a longevive one , till the moment when actual trend lines substituted entire race genepool. The last fortress of original lonvevive dobermanns was Eastern space till the moment of Berlin wall demolition and cold curtain raising , when actual trend lines , with political and occidental support, substituted entire Eastern countries genepool . That happened in Cehia, Poland, Hungary , Romania, Russia .
ReplyDeleteIn normal mode the responsable persons must to apologize in face of history about what happened , not to say LIES and today .
Oh yeah. I forgot. All of those Eastern European Dobermans that die young are from snake bites, eating nails, hit by cars... None of them ever have heart problems, Right.
ReplyDelete;-)
It is good that a dialogue begins. I would ask you not to talk about the errors of the past. the errors are made, but what we can do in future? how we can do to save the breed?
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said... "Oh yeah. I forgot. All of those Eastern European Dobermans that die young are from snake bites, eating nails, hit by cars... None of them ever have heart problems, Right.
ReplyDeleteMy dear Anonimus, actual dobes do not represent Eastern lines.
And yes , in the last 15 years dobermanns died by heart, by cancer by wobbler and others inimaginable ills ...
dobermann-verein-ev.de said...
ReplyDeleteIt is good that a dialogue begins. I would ask you not to talk about the errors of the past. the errors are made, but what we can do in future? how we can do to save the breed?
The dialogue is impossible because nobody assum the errors .
Future ? In my opinion the desaster will continue for majority of dobermanns.No escape for what is writed genetically. Only few lucky of them will escape.
So Mr dobermann-verein-ev.de. You seem to be important enough to make statements but you have no solution to these problems that we are breeding according to you. The dobermann as all other breeds aesthetically has changed. How can anyone GUARANTEE in an entire litter that NONE of that progeny will not die at early age? Even in humans you dont know when you card comes up. To say that cancer is genetic? How? Even healthy dogs that tests conform have progeny (maybe one) from a litter that will develop the Big C - but its parents and siblings dont. How do you expalin this? Fashion changes, the dogs we have today do not resemble what we had in the past. What do you REALLY want???? or what are you really trying to say that is constructive
ReplyDeleteAnonymous said...
ReplyDeleteHow can anyone GUARANTEE in an entire litter that NONE of that progeny will not die at early age
-------------
That is incorrect .
I think you live in the moon.
In reality from one litter , majority are died at early age.
I think you do not know in your sunny place that 40% from dobes died by heart and other 40% are affected by cancer, wobbler, kidney, imunitar system, skin problems , displazia and so on...
Nice sunny days in your place on the moon.
All problems of the Doberman are known described hundreds of times. it is fact, that the problems for large part, caused by the lack of gene diversity. Everyone knows who is to blame for this. Anyone who denies this is stupid. I'm not the new savior for all. all I wish is to create a plan for The Future of racial
ReplyDeleteCome On! One litter is going to base your gripe on the death factor in Dobermanns?? Get real!!! and to Dobermann Verein..... what are you actually doing other than talking
ReplyDeleteI created a forum. I tried to find people and ways to save the breed. What are you doing, Anonymous? oh sorry there are 50 Anonymous.
ReplyDeleteyes is true.but the worst is mr P which have blocked Mitto's pedigree in italy, or others dogs from del nasi kennel or v jahrestal...he is a mafia boy and he decided to make the korung in italy.....he decide a lot of shitty things and nobody tll him that he is a poor stupid man....is a shame
ReplyDeleteWhat do you mean that Pezzano blocked Mitto's pedigree?
ReplyDeleteMitto's pedigree in italy is blocked, if you use him in breeding his progeny wull have (MAYBE) the pedigree in 2 years.....he decides that Mitto's need his DNA in italy, and is in the italian DNA storage, so he ask also the DNA of his parents.....and for all this you have not all in 2 days but in a lot of months.....
ReplyDeleteI think that Mr. Pezzano did right things for this race. Inclusive the health checking for future IDC winners .
ReplyDeleteI think that all dobermanns must be DNA checked if they have in blood great-danes and ban the elephants pedigrees.
About this Mitto....he is one of most used males then is normal to check his DNA .
ReplyDeleteWe will waiting with interest the Italian results , I have no doubts that will be no problem .
he is checked from a lot of months but mr P don't want that his gorgeous progeny may win in italy! In italy only bad dogs and shitty progeny from the worst dobers ever...AA which have a lot of gorgeous death progeny!
ReplyDeleteAnd do you consider a pedigree based on 3 Baron Nike and 5 Heydy Royal Bell the solution ?
ReplyDeleteSorry that I disapointed you but Ale Alamos have much more secure genetic than this dog . We will see !
I have the same opinion. I can't understand why the whole breeders think that Mitto is an excellent producer. Yes, he is a nice dog, but not more... He has nothing outstanding.
ReplyDeleteprobably both are not good in genetics........all the pedigree of AA is based on a single dog Prinx v Norden Stamm.......and his granson GG wich is dead at what age?? 6? 7? but when his frozen semen was used when he was dead nobody cares......open your eyes and please remove from your face the Ham's slice!
ReplyDeleteI think that your eyes are closed or maybe the interests stopped you to see the truth. Prinzz and Gino represent the alternative of shit molosoidal domination fully by cancer, displazia, wobbler and DCM .
ReplyDeleteBecause similar Ebo genetic infected Citone line by DCM but Citone dogs still are not molosoidal and fully by skeleton problems and shit character .
are you sure??I'm not because in italy a few descendats from A litter and G litter del Citone where affected by hd C or D before talking please use your brain if you have it!
ReplyDeleteA lot of sons and daughter of ZZ or AA are dead, at young age, so please explain at the owners that are a safe line! And about Wobbler.....55 cases out of the same lines of the same dogs that are written here....open your eyes!
Mr. molosus breeder, your world are FALSE. Talk with NAMES not only bla bla bla.
ReplyDeleteThere is a public database and you can see ALL Gino Gomez descendants . ALL of them , ALL of them have good displazia . And they represent a HUGE number !This are FACTS and NAMES !
Then , who LIE? All that persons from database, or you ?
http://www.dobermannpedigrees.nl/modules/pedigree/dog.php?id=162
There aren't all the dogs in the database.is you want lick the ass of MR P because you have a bad black male...is your choice not mine! And I'm not a breeder.dear ALIN! You are a breeder adn the Dobermann Club of Romania have banned you!
ReplyDeleteYou saw Valencia/Weinberge everywhere. Even he was banned everywhere , by club, in DR site and banned himself in this breeding system , keep in mind that a Weinberge alwaws will be FREE and not a slave which kiss a ass for a title.
ReplyDeleteAbout Citto del Citone mabe he is not a IDC sieger in ooking but is a Excelent dog and his genetic baggage is rare and carry in blood more than 200 Weinberge names and D'acciaio .That is more importat .
W.A.
the whole DNA checking which is promoted nowerdays so much by the IDC and the DV is just some other subtile NAZI method to distroy unpleasant people. whoever is unpleasant will be asked for a DNA test and then he will be distroyed. who checks if the DV or the IDC really sent that certain DNA which was taken to the laboratory, an not maybe the DNA of some other dog in order to discredit that certain owner, who posseses the dog which is tested ? do you think that it is correct that an involved person, like the judge at a ZTP for example, takes the sample and sends it to the laboratory ? i don't think so. since we all know about the maffia structures of the IDC and it's helpers, the arranged shows and so on, do you really think that with the DNA tests they will be correct ? if you really think so, then you are NAIVE !!!
ReplyDeleteThe IDC right!
ReplyDeleteThe IDC or the DV have to publish the results of the DNA-investigation!
A little mistake. NOT the IDC is right :)
ReplyDeleteYou are right!
PS: and i do think that not a judge or breedwarden or any member of the club should be allowed to take the DNA-Sample but some authorized vet or authorized clinic who sends in the sample to the laboratory. ONLY like that you can prevent ABUSE which can be done by our IDC and DV politicians !!!! which we all know too well and we ALL know what they are capable of !!!
ReplyDeleteYou can not trust anyone! The DVD is corrupted. Before witnesses sealed samples are a chance. auditor perhaps the UNI Munich ?
ReplyDeleteVery interesting comensts from france in a chaboard :
ReplyDeleteVery funny how he consider a dog fully Franckenhorst free by Citone problems and how Citone is guilty .... LOL :-)
"I am really not against Pezzano, i am pretty sure that he has very good eyes and knowledge about the breed.... But even if i respect the breeder for all the work he has down, it is true that i personnaly don't like the him as a Man.
Maybe i am wrong, but i just don't think that he is good person and that he is doing good politic for the breed.
This is just my personal opinion, but at least he is doing this in front of everybody and if peoples are stupid enough to say nothing, then it is not my problem, i assume personally all my ideas...
But things for what i have absolutely no respect is peoples like you, who spend time speaking bad against other peoples in this kind of "Garbage can" called Chatboard" just because the Admin allow anonymous peoples to spend their time trying to destroy other persons cause they have nothing else to do in their own life.
The same with this "DOBERMANN INSIDER" Come on Man! put your nuts on the table (or the ones of your husband) and let us know who you are, assume what you are saying! "
Some persons are incredible funny persons about what they wroted on Facebook:
ReplyDelete"MITTO DEL NASI ... the real complete Dobermann.
Tuesday, November 22, 2011
"He is actually for me one of the best stud males in Europe because one of the most complete.
Free of "Citone" he is also a direct son of the fantastic Wallis Nikki of Tanderberg...for this he is the best :)
Great Morphology
Great Bloodline
Great Producer
Great Working ability
Good Health
Best dog to lives with, the m..."
And he invited all to see that miraculouse dogs live.
The question is : from frontal view , in their eyes , is possible ?
Just ask Sandrine where MITTO will be shown the next time :-)
ReplyDeletehttp://www.ildobermann.it/allevamento-del-citone-presenta-ale-alamo-del-citone-que-ventisca-della-via-del-samurai
ReplyDeleteno words........a genetical suicide.....maybe is they are lucky the puppies will live 3 years!
Please explain your comment!
ReplyDeletehttp://www.ildobermann.it/allevamento-del-citone-presenta-ale-alamo-del-citone-que-ventisca-della-via-del-samurai
ReplyDeleteno genetic variation......all the same dogs....so is a genetical suicide
Babil said...
ReplyDeleteno genetic variation......all the same dogs....so is a genetical suicide
March 17, 2013 at 11:45 AM
-------------------
And what variation do you sugest ?
The Cancer, Wobbler and Displazia? You are so funny...
This is a genetical war not a virgin girls game....
Pezzano is smart and he know genetic and all lines problems very well. He know to filtering surrogates and elephants out after get their power. Sure the price is huge now is time to WIN.
ReplyDeletethe power of ignorants people which think he is smart and knows genetics.....3 years maybe 4......and after I will laught of you, that are so stupid to believe him......a man involved in some problems.....take of the ham from your eyes
ReplyDeleteThe contact me button does not work.
ReplyDeleteCheck this out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=fEyO40FgguI
This is almost as bad as when Wiblishauser passed a dog at ZTP in South Africa with only ONE TESTICLE! This was a noticeable mistake on behalf of the Great Leader and which was later confirmed by Hassi Assemacher who had to dismiss it from the showring for the problem. Hassi Assenmacher was very embarrassed on Wibli's behalf but after she confirmed it was true she had to dive for cover. Apparently, Mr. Wiblishauser had left his Abacus at home that weekend.
ReplyDeleteMaybe he had some beer and did see the one twice?
ReplyDeleteHas Insiedr been killed?
ReplyDelete